• Forums like Galle Dialogue help reduce tensions and build understanding during challenging periods
• France, like Sri Lanka, committed to a rules-based order and protection of global commons

The 12th Galle Dialogue International Maritime Conference kicked off in Colombo last month, drawing participation from 37 nations. Amongst the many naval officers, diplomats, and subject matter experts gathered for the key regional maritime security event was a French delegation led by Rear Admiral Hugues Lainé, Joint Commander of the French Forces in the Indian Ocean.

He joined the Plenary Session of the conference featuring high-level insights from a distinguished panel including Indian Navy Chief of Staff Admiral Dinesh K. Tripathi, Russian Navy Deputy Commander-in-Chief Admiral Vladimir Vorobev, and Sichuan University Institute of South Asian Studies Deputy Director Dr. Yunsong Huang.

The Sunday Morning caught up with Rear Admiral Lainé and Directorate General for International Relations and Strategy (DGIRS) Deputy Director and Maritime Security Coordinator Captain Sebastien Perruchio from the French delegation for an exclusive interview.

Following are excerpts: 

You are back in Colombo after six months to attend the Galle Dialogue organised by the Sri Lanka Navy (SLN). How do you gauge the Galle Dialogue as a regional conference on maritime security and governance? Is it an important event in the Indian Ocean calendar?

Lainé: The Galle Dialogue is a recognised and well-known event related to maritime dialogue on security in the Indian Ocean Region. It is well known amongst the navies and the wider community. You saw that today, for the forum, the SLN managed to gather numerous State actors and experts about our shared interest in regional security. Many countries participate – I think there are 32 this time – which shows the wide recognition the Galle Dialogue has attracted. 

Also, the specific situation of Sri Lanka, which is open and inclusive, is welcoming for all who wish to discuss and exchange views on maritime security. As France, we are here sharing our views and participating in multilateralism for regional security and stability.

I would say, in challenging times in the world, forums such as the Galle Dialogue are of utmost importance, as they help to decrease tensions and promote peace and multilateral initiatives. France has always responded ‘present’ to the Sri Lanka Navy’s invitations and we consider this an especially important event in the calendar for maritime security-related dialogue. 

Do you think Colombo has the potential to become the regional hub for furthering maritime security and governance-related dialogue?

Perruchio: I think the Sri Lankan position both geographically and politically is unique. Sri Lanka tries to gather everyone to bring them to dialogue – like you have done with Galle Dialogue this week – and has an ability to bring everyone together and foster the environment needed to discuss matters related to maritime security. I think Sri Lanka has a particular role to play, and it takes part in regional and extraregional efforts to improve maritime security and safety.

Lainé: I think there is also another factor: Sri Lanka has a strong will and ambition to reinforce maritime governance and ensure security in the region. You have been heading the Indian Ocean Rim Association (IORA) and you have other regional platforms like the Colombo Security Conclave ongoing. Sri Lanka has a proactive spirit with both the SLN and the island’s leadership on strengthening maritime security and governance.

France has committed significant resources to your command and the Indian Ocean Region (IOR). Can you explain why we see an increase in French security and military activity in the Indian Ocean?   

Lainé: Of course France has been committed to the region; we are part of the IOR. We have two commands, one in the UAE and another in Djibouti. I won’t say we are increasing our capabilities in the region, it’s more like we are renovating our capabilities. We are committed to the region. France is an Indian Ocean nation, with over 1.6 million citizens and our Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) makes up almost 15% of the Indian Ocean. 

We have many friends and allies, but we are not aligned as ‘blocs’. We want to play a role as a balancing power. We want to play a role in the security of the region. We are directly invested and have interest through our overseas French territories. 

Not only in the Indian Ocean, even in the Pacific and Atlantic, we have the second largest EEZ in the world, which is why maritime security, environmental protection, economic development, freedom of navigation, and multilateral cooperation are important, not to mention the safety of global shipping lanes. These are priorities for us.

We are also committed to stand by our partners and we have different defence agreements. With the Emirates, we have a strategic partnership. We also have a political commitment, which was reaffirmed by President Emmanuel Macron in Colombo in 2023 and during the Shangri-La Dialogue recently as well.

France and Sri Lanka as nations of the Indian Ocean rely heavily on the ‘rules-based order’ for security, safety, and good commerce. Our Prime Minister spoke of it during the inaugural session, calling the rules-based order the cornerstone of stability. What are your key concerns about maritime security and law enforcement in the IOR?

Lainé: We share the same perspective about the rules-based order. There are many different threats in the maritime domain. 

In terms of priority for us right now, I would say, combatting arms trafficking – the flow of weapons – is of utmost importance. These arms supply terrorist groups and criminal groups. It keeps groups like the Houthis armed and thereby pose a threat to maritime commerce and shipping. 

Secondly, drug and human trafficking is a major concern. We are also concerned about Illegal, Unregulated, and Unreported (IUU) fishing and about the protection of critical connectivity infrastructure such as undersea submarine cables. 

We also need to secure strategic chokepoints and global commons, like the Bab al-Mandab Strait, the Strait of Hormuz, and the Strait of Malacca. Today we all discussed the need to improve resilience against climate change-related challenges and natural disasters. The effect of climate change in the Indian Ocean has been significant.

Perruchio: In terms of geopolitical competition, that has always been there. However, it should be within the rules. You need rules; without rules competition turns to confrontation, so you need rules. We want to avoid confrontation; we need to agree on the rules and move forward.

How concerned are you about the proliferation of autonomous and unmanned systems amongst non-state actors in the IOR? Do you think such developments pose a significant threat to sea lines of communication, coastal infrastructure, and energy security?

Lainé: There has been a rapid development of unmanned systems. They can be used to threaten the sea lines of communications, ports, critical coastal infrastructure, and energy infrastructure; they can also be a threat to submarine cables if they are used by malicious actors. The Houthis are a good example of this. 

The use of Unmanned Aircraft Systems (UAS), Unmanned Surface Vehicles (USVs), and Unmanned Underwater Vehicles (UUVs) are threats when used by actors who mean to disrupt or harm established order. It is not the technology but the user and use of it with bad intentions which is the threat, be it by state or non-state actors.

To combat that, we need to develop methods and techniques to prevent and protect against the use of such unmanned systems on our lines of communication and infrastructure. This reality was highlighted by a remark by the Indian Navy Chief of Staff Admiral Dinesh K. Tripathi today, who pointed out that we fight against low-cost, low-tech systems and drones using high-cost, high-tech systems. 

This is why we need to find new methods to deal with them. The solutions are coming. Today, we can engage drones with some types of artillery, missiles, electronic warfare, and jamming. We need to keep developing countermeasures.

The French-Sri Lankan initiative of establishing the Regional Centre for Maritime Studies (RCMS) has begun its operations and is delivering multiple training programmes for Sri Lankan and regional officials. How can your commands assist in these efforts?

Lainé: The RCMS in Colombo, established with French assistance, is operational now. It provides regional training focused on state action at sea – fishing control, fire fighting, search and rescue, countering trafficking, port security, and others. 

My command can provide some expertise; we have legal advisers who can provide training on state action at sea and about anti-smuggling operations. We can also provide other expertise. We can promote awareness about the RCMS and help with networking with partners.

With regard to the RCMS, is this the first time France has set up such a training school?

Perruchio: It is the French Ministry of Foreign Affairs which is the direct actor linked to the RCMS. The RCMS is aimed at becoming a national school with regional reach to help build capacities of countries like Sri Lanka in dealing with maritime security, safety, and governance. We have helped to establish a similar school in the Gulf of Guinea.

Do you envisage greater support from France to help Sri Lankan maritime law enforcement and capacity building of military institutions in the future?

Lainé: France is committed to see the RCMS succeed. We don’t always have assets (ships/aircraft) nearby, but we try to arrange at least one port visit from time to time. During such visits, we use the opportunity to host workshops for capacity building and share experiences and expertise. These exchanges are helpful. 

We also continue to have our staff talks at the armed forces level. There is potential for the French Hydrography Office to cooperate with Sri Lanka’s National Hydrographic Office (NHO). France also has many things to learn from Sri Lanka, especially the Sri Lankan Navy – for example, how you are dealing with IUU fishing and such issues.

What are your views about regional concerns about seabed mapping and risks posed to critical undersea infrastructure like data cables and pipelines? Do you think that platforms like IORA and the Indian Ocean Commission (IOC) can be a platform to discuss such concerns?

Lainé: This subject is sensitive as it is linked to sovereignty and security. There is a growing risk of malicious action in the seabed and from seabed mining. France is supporting a multilateral approach to discuss such concerns. 

I think IORA and the IOC are well placed to discuss such concerns. Of course, since sovereignty issues are also linked to such concerns, bilateral discussions may also be an effective means to discuss the concerns and find solutions.